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LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY,
WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 24.
The Speaker took the chair at 4.30 p.m.
MUSEUM AND ART GALLERY.
The Premier laid on the table the report
of the committee of the Museum and nrc
Gallery for the year 1909-10.
NOTICES.
The following notices were given:
Mr. Bath, to move for leave to introduce
a Bill to amend the bread Act, 1903.
Mr. Horan, to ask the Minister for Rail
ways :-Does the Railway Department con
template the removal of" the West Perth
Loco. Depot to East Perth or other suburban
station?"
Mr. Horan, to ask the Minister for Mines:
-"Is he satisfied that the present backward
state of the geological survey of Western
Australia warrants the granting of four
months' leave of absence to the State Min
ing Engineer?"
aIr. Draper, to ask the Premier:-"Will
the Government bring in a Bill this ses
sion to amend the Public Service Act, 1904,
with respect to (1) The payment of annual
increments within a class up to the classifi2d
value of the position; (2) The re-constitu
tion of the Appeal Board?"
Mr. Draper, to ask the Premier:-'L
Have the Government refused to grant pen
tions under the Superannuation Act to any
persons for any reason other than miscon
duct? (2) If so, under what authority and
what are the names of the persons so re
fused?"
REPLIES TO QUESTIONS.
The Minister for Railways, in reply to
Mr. Swan, said that the alterations and ad
ditions to the Railway Salaried Staff Regula
tions, as per weekly notice 19, 1910, gazet
ted during April, 1910, had been laid on the
table of the House that afternoon. They
were overlooked at the beginning of the
scesion.
The Premier, in reply to Mr. Piesse, said
that he was aware that some local govern
ing bodies, had protested against the !evy
under the District Fire Brioadeas Act, 1909.
In no instance were the focal authorities
individually consulted before assessment
otherwise than through their legally consti
tuted representative on the Board. He sas
not aware that the Fire Brigades Board
had resolved to take legal proceedings
against defaulting municipalities and Dis
trict Roads Boards. The Colonial Secretary
was at present in conference with the Board
in regard to giving relief to the loca
bodies.
THE MARRIAGE ACT.
Mr. Murphy obtained leave to introduce
a Bill to amend the Marriage Act. 1894.
The Bill was read the first time, and the
second reading fixed for the next sitting.
DISTRICT FIRE BRIGADES.
Mr. Piesse moved:-"That there be pre
pared and laid upon the table of the House
a return showing (a) The municipalities and
District Roads Boards that have been
scheduled as contributors under the District
Fire Brigades Act, 1909, setting forth the
amount of contribution assessed against
each local authority for the present year;
(b) The basis upon which such contribution
has been arrived at." He had, he said,
brought forward the motion as a result of
complaints made throughout the country
districts. Only quite recently the Katanning
Roads Board were called upon to pay £14U
as a contribution towards the District Fire
Brigades Board. He did not think that a
District Roads Board should be called open
to make such large contributions in view of
the fact that the revenue at their disposal
,was very small and was required for road
making. He could not see that under the
present Act the Mipister had power to ex
empt any districts from payment, and, if
that were so, it would be necessary for the
Government to bring forward an amending;
measure so that relief might be provided
in certain cases.
Mr. Scaddan Laid that he must object to
the motion by Mr. Piesse being placed first
on the list of notices, seeing that it was
not a formal mot~n and had been given
notice of only on the previous day.
The Premier pointed out that Mr. Piesse
had given notice of the matter in the form
of a question, and he (the Premier) had
suggested that it should be put in the form
of a motion. He did not anticipate that
the hon. member was going to make any
comment on it when it was placed on the
top of the list. Personally, he was not pre
pared to discuss the matter at the present
time, and would have no objection to treat
ing it as a formal motion.
Mr. Brown said that as chairman of the
Fire Brigades Board he had instructed the
secretary to prepare the return, and he
would be only too glad to give it to the
hon. member.
Mr: Jagoby, said that he hoped the House
would agree to the motion.
Mr. Taylor secured the adjournment of
the debate.
REVENUE FROM THE GOLDFIELDS.
Mr. Collier moved :--'That there be laid
upon the table of the House a return show
ing: (1) The total amount of dividend tax
collected last year. (2.) The proportion
paid by companies operating on the eastern
goldfields. (3.) The proportion of the
revenue raised from the issue of licences for
the manufacture and sale of beer, wines,
ani spirituous liquors, collected on the east
ern goldfields, or from persons or companies
operating thereon. (4.) The amount of in
come tax payable last financial year by
persons living on the eastern goldfields."
The Premier said that if the fourth para
graph in the motion was omitted the other
mformation would be procurable.
Mr. Honlman moved that the fourth para
raph should be deleted.
The amendment was carried, and the mo
tion as amended was agreed to.
REPURCHASED ESTATES.
Mr. Taylor moved;-"That there be laid
upon the table a return showing the name,
number, and acreage of estates purchased
by the Government since 1902 for land set
tlement purposes, with the price paid in each
case, together with the name of the vendor.
The motion was agreed to op the voices.
FAICHING AND THE RAILWAY COM
MISSIONER.
Mr. Gill formally moved thte following
motion:-"That all Sles m connection wren
the case of Faiching v. Commissioner for
Railways, that recently came before the
Perth local Court, be laid on the table of
the House."
The Minister for Mines said he would pre
fer not to lay the papers on the table of
the House, because there were certain mat
ters contained in them dealing with wages
and so forth, which should not be made
public. He would be pleased to show the
papers to Mr. Gill in his office.
Leave was given to postpone the motion
for a week:
THE AVONDALE ESTATE.
Mr. An"win formally moved the following
motion:--'Tht all papers, including the
report of the Land Purchase Board dstealing
with the purchase by the Government of the
Avondale Estate, situated in the Beverley
district, from Messrs. Butcher Bros., be
laid on the table of the House."
The Minister for Lands said he. had no
objection, and the motion Was agreed to.
STATE SECONDARY SCHOOL.
Mr. Daglish moved the following mo
tion:-"That all papers relating to the ap
ointment of the headmaster of the Secca
dary School be laid upon the table of the
House." In doing so he said his object
was to enable members of the House to see
if there were not already men on the staff
of the department fit for the position. In
that instance a man had been appointed
from outside the State, comparatively
young and inexperienced, and without any
previous training, as the principal of an
educational establishment. He was, of course,
a highly educated gentleman, and fully qua
lifieA from that aspect, but his capacity to
organise a new and important institution
snch as the State Secondary School was of
necessity problematical.
Mr. Collier: Was he appointed by the
Public Service Commissioner?
. Mr. Daglish said that the papers would
show. At all events the gentleman lacked
the experience which a large number of
officers in the service undoubtedly possessed.
If it were possible he should like to see in
matters of that kind prior consideration
given to those deserving officers who were
already in the service.
The Minister for Education said he would
not oppose the motion, but thought the pro
per time for a discussion would arrive when
the papers were laid on the table. He would
say, however, that in making the appoint
ment regard was paid to the qualifications
of officers already in the service. He was
entirely at one with the mover in agree
ing that other things being equal a local
officer should be appointed. Unless, how
ever, there were positive instructions to the
department that in making its choice it
must not go outside the State then he con
tended that it should in making its selection
endeavour to obtain the gentleman who
seemed in every way most suited to the ap
pointment. The particular gentleman m
question had the highest qualifications, and
the greatest promise of filling the post suc
cessfully. The primary consideration was not
so much the claims of the candidates but the
advantages that would be likely to accrue to
the school by the selection of this man or
that.
Mr. Murphy said that the question raised
at once brought to mind that other ques
tion of the grievances of civil servants. The
preference, should, he contended, always be
given to those servants who had faithfully
carried out their duties for years past. The
.thought of that promotion was an incentive
to our civil servants to do their best: In
many instances civil servants had been
passed over in favour of outsiders. For in
stance, a gentleman had recently been ap
pointed over the heads of Government men
equally qualified to the post of master of
the Old Men's Home. Then there had re
cently been some peculiar transactions in
connection with the Harbour Trust at Fre
mantle.
Mr. Daglish: All roads lead to Fremantle.
(Laughter.)
Mr. Murphy: And why not? It is the
pivot of the State. Continuing, he pro
ceeded to relate the circumstances surround
ing the appointment at Fremantle of Pilot
Clarke (late of the s.s. Koombana), who, he
said, had had but little experience of the
port.
Mr. Collier: Why don't you include that
in the motion?
Mr. Murphy: I intend to move as an
amendment that these papers also should
be laid on the table.
Mr. Bolton: Who appointed him?
Mr. Murphy: It was not the Government.
Continuing he said it was unfair on general
grounds that State officers should be over
looked if they were in any way fitted for
positions that were vacant. He hoped that
the papers would be laid upon the table,
and that the civil servants would understand
that they were to get as good a deal as any
one outside.
Mr. Bath agreed that the interests of those
who were to receive instruction should be
taken into consideration primarily, and if
there were officers in the service of the State
who were competent to fill the position, the
fact that they had been in the service rlould
be considered. It was remarkable to hear
from the Minister that in the Education De
partment there were not those who were
competent to fill this position.
The Minister for Education: I never made
that admission. I said that the gentleman
appointed was, in my opinion, the most
competent.
Mr. Bath said that seemed to be only
characteristic of what unfortunately was too
common throughout Australia. That was
the depreciation of Australians, and in this
instance it was the depreciation of the o..i
cers of their own Department. The question
of degrees acquired either at Oxford or Ade
laide was not the only consideration in mak
ing such an appointment.
Mr. Daglish: It is the teacher, not the
scholar
Mr. Bath said that in the Education Do
pertment there were many officers who had
also secured degrees, and they had an addi
tional advantage. The estabhihient of this
secondary or modern school would be an
other link in the educational system of the
State, and he contended that the man who
was best fitted to fill the office of head
master of the school was the man who. had
had experience in the educational work of
the State. He (Mr. Bath) was not convinced
that the fact that the selected applicant
had secured degrees at Oxford was evidence
of his qualifications to carry on the educa
tional work as they knew it in this State.
Western Australia was in some respects in
advance in pflmary education compared with
the old country and other parts of Australia
and he believed there were gentlemen in
that department whose qualifications so far
as their training to be teachers was con
cerned, and, more important still, their ex
perience in local conditions and circum
stances, rendered them superior for this
special appointment to any other applicant
from outside. That being so he held that
the best selection had not been made.
Mr. Jacoby: Can you spy that without
seeing the applications?
Mr. Bath said from general knowledge he
could say that the qualifications and experi
ence of the local applicants rendered them
superior, and he did not think the Minister
had appointed the gentleman who was best
fitted for the position. He did not want to
disparage the qualifications of the gente
man who had been appointed, but he did
believe that there were officers already in
the Department who were specially and
peculiarly fitted for the position.
The Minister for Works thought that
members would do well to wait until the
papers were tabled before they discussed the
merits of the appointment. He knew that
chis appointment had been carefully con
sidered by the Inspector-General and by the
Public Service Commissioner, and the papers
were closely scrutinised by the Minister. He
oelieved when members saw the papers and
evidences of the care that had been exer
cised they would conclude, although they
were all desirous that their own people
should have the preference, all things being
equal, that a very wise appointment had
been made. He agreed that University de
grees should not be;the only consideration,
and that there were many other qualifica
tions required for a successful headniaster of
a secondary school, and they could not af
ford to make any mistakes in extending the
education system out of sentimental con
sideration for anyone.
Mr. Jacoby held that many disappaint
ments had occurred in this State and in
other parts of Australia by trusting entirely
to written credentials and recommendations,
but he thought it would be found when the
papers were scrutinised that the appoint
ment in this instance was a wise one. In
the Inspector-General, the Civil Service Comi
missioner, and the Minister for 'Education
they .had a qeIectidi board that it would Sb
impossible to improve upon, and they cbuld
have every confidence in the appoinment
which they had'made.
Mr. Daglish aid his contention was that
the gentleman appointed had not had that
practical experience in organisation or in
school control that was necessary. The
member for Swan had stated that there
had been numerous instances of failure
through appointing officers merely because
they were in the service. No one was advo
cating such a course as that. His conten
tion had been that no man should be de
barred from an appointment merely because
he happened to belong to the State. He
argued also that it had been possible to
make an appointment from the officers of
the Western Aust-alian service. He under
stood that the Minister had made a physiog
nomical assay of the appointee before ac.
cepting his credentials. (Laughter.) When
he had an opportunity of'perusing the
papers he would again refer to the subject.
The motion was agreed ,to.
THE LIQUOR TRADE.
Mr. Murphy moved that a return be laid
upon the table showin--(1) The capital
Ivalue (approximate) of the premises ustd in
the manufacture or sale of beer, wines, and
spirituous liquors in the Stat:; (2) the num
ber of employees engaged in the liquor trade
in the State. He said that the inforniatios
would be easily obtainable, and would be
mefu1 in tha rChamber laet on.
ýMr. Daglish moved as an amendment
that the return should also show the rental
value.
Mr. Murphy accepted the amendment,
which was not seconded.
Mr. Foulkes then moved the addition of the
following words:-(3) The amounts paid as
annual rent and ingoing for licences with
respect to houses licensed to sell liquors,
and the amounts paid to the State annually
for such licences by the licenisees.
Mr. Angwin hoped that the effect of the
motion. if it were adopted, would not be to
delay the Licensing Bill.
The Attorney-General: I am afraid it will.
The Minister for Works said that the re
turn would take a long time to prepare,
and would possibly cost a considerable sum
of money. There was some information in
the possession of the Department already,
although it was not nearly so complete as
what this return was designed to supply.
The magnitude of the task would be recog
nised when they remembered that there
were 1,200 licences throughout the State. Ho
very much feared that the information
would not be ready for consideration along
- with any measure introduced that session.
" Mr. Bath commanded the mover of the
motion to possess his soul in patience until
1911, when the information he sought would
be compiled in connection with the census.
b Mr. Muiphy said he would accept the
I amendment moved by Mr. Foulkes. The
question was of sufficient importance to
justify them in asking that information
from all standpoints should be submitted to
the House. At the same time he did not
want to see the Bill delayed. Let the Gov
ernment proceed with the measure, and he
would have to be satisfied with what in
E formation was available.
Mr. Foulkes asked whether the informa
tion collected by the Crown Law Depart
menb with regard to the amounts paid for
rent and ingoing in respect of a certain
number of licences would in the meantime
be laid on the table.
The Attorney-General replied in the af
firmative.
The motion as amended was then agreed
to.
WORKERS' COMPENSATION BILL.
Mr. Hudson moved the second reading of
the Workers' Compensation Act Amendment
1 Bill. which he had broueht forward in ore
vious sessions. He said that last session a Bill
exactly the same as that before the House
had reached the Committee stage. As
the Bill had been fully explained on previous
occasions he did not intend to speak at
length on it. He. however, urged upon the
Government the necessity for giving an op
portunity for the earlv assage of the Bill
this sission. The principles of the parent
measure had not been departed from. A few
amendments had been rendered by experi
ence in the administration of the Act, and
1 the Bill made provision for the enlarge
ment of some of the definitions, so as to
extend the operations of the Bill. Tho
principal one was in regard to. the number
of, persons who would be affected by the
measure.when it became law. A similar
provision with regard to the defin?tion of
S'worker" was included in the English Act
of 1906. and we Lad the experience of its
operation in England. Another amendment
was the extension of th; benefits of the
" Act to persons suffering from disease con
tracted in an industry. This had particular
application to the mining industry, but it
referred only to those who lost their lives
or contracted diseases peculiar to that indus
- try. The measure had been working sati.
factorily in England.
The Minister for Mines said that the mea
" sure, although small in compass, fairly brist
led with amendments of importance to vari
ous industries. There was only one pro
vision of the amending Bill he desired to
deal with. That was the clause which
would enable a worker who contracted dis
ease to recover compensation from the em
ployer for whom he was working at the
time he became affected with the complaint.
He felt sure that the hon. member was try
ing to do some good to the persons working
in a very big industry, but the question
was whether they were going on the right
lines. He had never heard of the death of
a person being ascribed to silicosis or an,
thracosis. It would be an extremely diffi
cult thing for a doctor to swear that any
patient was suffering from those diseases.
He was very much under the impression
that by having the proposed clauses in the
Act they would cause an enormous amount
of trouble at first between the employer and
the employee. He was afraid that the
employers would refuse to engage men un
less after medical examination it was proved
that they were not suffering from or were
not likely to contract silicosis. At the pre
sent time he had power under the Mines
Regulation Act to draft regulations dealing
with the examination and exclusion from
the mines of persons likely to be aected by .
tuberculosis and other diseases, but he had
purposely refrained from taking such ac
tion. It was a moot point whether they
had not acted wrongly in not insisting that
any person suffering from tuberculosis
should not be allowed to work underground.
Until some provision was made for men who
would be prevented from following their
usual calling, he did not like to take any
action. He had always felt, however, that
in the interests of those who had good
health something should be done to prevent
others suffering from the disease from work
ing underground beside them. He felt sure
that the workmen would refuse to undergo
a medical examination, with the result that
they would be bound to have labour trou
bles throughout the goldfields. The Gov
ernment were not in the position of the
New Zealand Government of having an
accident insurance company of their own.
So far as he could read the Bill, it appeared
to him that it would cause nothing but
trouble all round. Silicosis, he understood,
was a difficult disease to diagnose. It was
a slow insidious complaint, and a person
might be suffering from it for 10 years and
be able to go on with his ordinary avoca
tion without showing any bad result. Yet
the person who was employing the man at
the time he suddently discovered that he was
suffering from the disease would be com
pelled to pay compensation, although the
disease might have been contracted in an
other part of the world, or in an adjoining
mine. The Bill set out that the employer
could sue somebody else who had previously
employed the man, but the whole of the
difficulty would be upon the person who had
last employed the man. In regard to the
clauses dealing with the 'ihalation of gases,
he thought they would be starting in the
wrong way if they adopted them. He did
not know that they were not wrong in re
gard to the whole principle of the Work
men's Compensation Act. He thought it
would be possible to initiate some system by
which .both the employer and the employee
and-he was only speaking for himself-the
State also should subscribe to a workers'
compensation fund. The man who was pre
pared to battle for himself, such as the
prospector and the small mine-owner, was
not protected in any sense under the Act.
it was only the wages man who was pro
tected. If instead of limiting the amount
payable in the event of death that amount
could be increased, there would be no difli
culty so far as the mining. companies were
concerned in accepting the proposition. If
they had a measure such as that they
should try to shake it apply to the person
who was working his own mine m the
event of his contracting disease or accident
the same as the man who was working for
wages. When they had litigation there
was always a certain amount of feeling. It
had been pointed out that when an accident
occurred, and the manager had come for
ward with assistance, and sent a man away
for the sake of his health, it had been held
in cases of action being subsequently taken
to be an admission of liability. The result
was that in cases of accident the managers
were afraid now to give assistance in the
early stages.
Mr. Hudson: There is an opportunity here
to make a short amendment to rectify that.
The Minister for Mines said he had not
consulted the Premier on the question, but
it seemed to him that it would be advisable
to have the subject dealt with by a Select
Committee, so that they would get the
best possible measure. As it was at pre
sent the Bill would do a lot of injury to
the mining industry, and he would not be
prepared to support the second reading.
The second reading was agreed to on the
voices, and the Committee stage was fixed
-for Wednesday next.
TRIBUTERS BILL.
Mr. Walker moved the second reading of
the Tributers Bill, the object of which he
said was to give some relief and some se
curity to those workers who were classed
as tributers on the goldfields-those
who were not owners of mines
or leases, but who did .most of
the developing dnd prospecting work.
Those tributers were too often treated some.
what harshly. Considering the good they
did the mining industry m keeping many
mines going, the department charged too
much in the way of a licence fee. The Bill,
therefore, proposed to reduce the fee from
£1 to 5s., which was a fair sum and would
not mean any loss to the revenue. It also
provided that tributes should be in de
finite written form, and that there should
be a penalty for not signing tributes. Again,
any special development work, over and
above the conditions of the agreement, done
at the request of the owner or lessee, should
be paid for in cash at the current rate of
wages. Too often the tributer was turned
off a mine as soon as he struck payable"
stone, and the Bill proposed to obviate that
by enacting that the tribute should be for
at least six months. One of the main fea
tures of the Bill was clause 8, which, for
the purpose of the Workers Compensation
Act, said that tributers should be workers
in the employ of the other party to the
tribute. This was a reasonable prevision,
seeing that many a mine would have to be
forfeited if it were not for the fact that the
tributers were deemed to be workers ful
filling the labour conditions. The Bill fuir
ther proposed a species of compulsory in
surance to cover tee owner or lessee aganst
liability under the Workers Compensation
Act. To that end a fixed scale of weekly
payments in proportion to the tributer's es
timated average weekly earnings was pro.
vided for, and it was stipulated that the
compensation be paid on an estimate of
the tributer's weekly earnings. There was
also a penalty for contributions otherwise
exacted. The Bill if passed into law would
be of vast benefit to a large number of
miners on the goldfields.
The Minister for Mines said that any
question affecting the granting of tributes
had to be approached very gingerly. Trouble
had arisen in Victoria where Bendigo had
dsired a certain line of action to be fol
lowed with reference to tributes, while Bal.
larat favoured a different policy. Tributers,
be thought, should be able to apply to the
warden for an extension of their tribute
in the event of development work occupying
longer than they had at first anticipated.
A tributer under a six months' agreement
might spend the whole .of that period in
purely development work, the benefit of
which would then accrue to the leaseholder.
He had had in contemplation the framing -
of a regulation empowering a warden under
such circumstances to grant an. extension of
the tribute. The tributer as a rule was a
splendid type of man, and as a class the
tributers had done a good deal to stimulate
the mining industry. They took responsi
bilities and risks and were deserving of
every encouragement. If they were to bring
them under the Workers Compensation Act
it would probably be found advisable to as
sess the compensation according to the
weekly earnings of those following a simi
lar calling, namely, mining. As to the
measure as a whole it would be desirable
to obtain an expression of opinion from the
gcldfields.
The second reading was agreed to, and
the committee stage was fixed for Septem
ber 7.
GERALDTON MUNICIPALITY GAS
SUPPLY BILL.
,Mr. Carson, in moving the second reading
of the Bill, said that its object was to em
power the municipality of Geraldton to ao
quire the Geraldton Gas Works from the
Colonial Gas Association, Ltd. Some 14
years ago the right to supply gas to the
town was given to the Association, the
agreement being for 21 years, with a pro
vision that the municipality could purchase
the works at the expiration of 14 years on
giving 12 months' notice. This notice had
been given, and the present Bill was neces.
sary to complete the contract with the com.
pany. The gas works were a paying con
cern, and the proposition was a good one
for the municipality of Geraldton. There
had been no objection raised by the rate
payers to the purchase of the works, and it
was now only necessary to get the Bill
through.
The second reading was carried on the
voices, and the consideration of the Bill in
committee was fixed for Wednesday next.L
ADJOURNMENT.
At 9.35 p.m. the House adjourned to 4.3C
p.m. on the following day.
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